Did I make a donk call?

UTG 58 1450 chips
UTG +1 Q9 12,150
Button (Hero) Q10 12,000


UTG shoves Preflop
UTG +1 calls
Hero calls

Flop

Q95 all spades

UTG Check
Hero Check

Turn

5 Clubs

UTG shoves

???PAUSE???? At this point I I'm thinking he's definitely got a queen and he is afraid of another spade coming on the river so he's trying to discourage anybody to continue to draw. I didn't put him on a flush, more of a semi bluff at best.????

Hero Calls

River

4 Diamonds



In review my initial gut instinct seemed right that he was trying to protect, but I really didn't put him on two pair.

Anyway he had me covered and I'm out of the tourney.

Hero drives home wearing sad face. :(


When facing massive over bets, what is your thinking process, or do you just figure your automatically beat? I would of thought for sure we would of checked the hand down and there really is no point into bluffing into a side pot. I guess I should of know....

So what are your opinions.

My opinion, based on playing a lot of tourney's off and on over the years is......In questionable situations where you may think you have the best hand, even putting your opponent on weaker hand than yours......it is sometimes better to fold rather than put your entire chip stack at risk. You may win those situations sometimes....but..... I personally think it's better to wait and pick a better spot unless your shortstacked......It's hard to play like that and takes a lot of discipline but it is mathematically intelligent

well u seem to have left out the result other than he won but umm what did he have O.o

on another note tho yes u did make a dumbass donk call there was a paired and flushed board and all u have was Q's and 5's with a T kicker...pretty weak given the circumstances AND he was raising u...

What where the blinds at this point? Right now I think you made a very weak call on the initial players all in bet and UTG +1 call.
Regardless of the flop what are you hoping to hit. You are putting in over 10% of you stack on a Q10. In this situation you are ahead pre flop, but normally Q10 is a trouble hand. It is easily dominated and really risky to put in over 10% of your stack. If a Queen or a 10 hit, how confident could you be that it is the best hand with the action that preceded it.

If you had a read on UTG +1 that told you he/she was going to call with crap then you might as well push all in preflop that way you are getting the extra dead money versus the original raiser. That could justify playing the weak hand. But a call puts you in a situation that the pot is all ready so big you don't have much room to maneuver to find out where your hand stands on the flop.

On the flop the pot has 4500 chips now. If UTG +1 does a standard C Bet, that is about 2000 chips. If you reraise to see where you are. Your reraise would be at least 2000 additional chips and most likely 4000 additional. So 6000 chips of your remaining 10,550. But you normally wouldn't even do that since you have committed so many chips. You would probably just go all in over a C Bet. If you where going to do that you might as well have done it preflop. Not saying that is correct but...

I am just saying that when the action comes to you preflop you need to ask yourself what you are planning on doing. What is your plan for this hand. How will the size of the pot dictate the action that will happen afterwards based on you and UTG +1s stack sizes.

In my opinion if I was going to speculate on a hand like this in that situation, the UTG +1 and myself would both have to have stacks exceeding 28000 chips. This way you have room to play. This way you aren't speculating with trash with over 10% of your stack.

I do believe that you did a "Donk Call". However, in my opinion that "Donk Call" is the initial call that got you in this mess.

Thank you for the responses it gives me a lot to think about.

The blinds were 600,1200 with 50 ante.

its not an easy decision...but my opinion is that your call was not good...

ehhhhhhhhhhhhh idk....what else coulda been done ....sometimes you need to make certain moves that might not make sense or even be correct....gotta go with it sometimes

Thanks for adding the details about the blinds, didn't realize you were already at 10xBB as a shorter stack. I'd vote that your call was a weak call, possibly considered bad but it's preference fo style. You're technically a short stack at this point with less than 10 big blinds to your name (factoring in the ante). So realistically you are at the point of needing to be the aggressor, not the caller. Q10 is a hand you can raise with but not in this position with the action in front of you of a shove (even with a shorter stack) and a caller who has you stacked. i think your two plays here are reshoving (bad idea with that holding) or folding, probably a better play to let someone else knock out the player and avoid you risking your stack or tripling up another player. Even after the flop you can't feel too strongly about a 10 kicker since you are dominated by AQ, KQ, QJ, all likely holdings for a player that would call UTG and willing to risk 10% of his stack to eliminate a player. Long story short, i don't think you should have even called the preflop bet. That could have saved your stack as well as avoided potential bad situations like this.

Fish

Quote:

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Originally Posted by deedbr

What where the blinds at this point? Right now I think you made a very weak call on the initial players all in bet and UTG +1 call.
Regardless of the flop what are you hoping to hit. You are putting in over 10% of you stack on a Q10. In this situation you are ahead pre flop, but normally Q10 is a trouble hand. It is easily dominated and really risky to put in over 10% of your stack. If a Queen or a 10 hit, how confident could you be that it is the best hand with the action that preceded it.

If you had a read on UTG +1 that told you he/she was going to call with crap then you might as well push all in preflop that way you are getting the extra dead money versus the original raiser. That could justify playing the weak hand. But a call puts you in a situation that the pot is all ready so big you don't have much room to maneuver to find out where your hand stands on the flop.

On the flop the pot has 4500 chips now. If UTG +1 does a standard C Bet, that is about 2000 chips. If you reraise to see where you are. Your reraise would be at least 2000 additional chips and most likely 4000 additional. So 6000 chips of your remaining 10,550. But you normally wouldn't even do that since you have committed so many chips. You would probably just go all in over a C Bet. If you where going to do that you might as well have done it preflop. Not saying that is correct but...

I am just saying that when the action comes to you preflop you need to ask yourself what you are planning on doing. What is your plan for this hand. How will the size of the pot dictate the action that will happen afterwards based on you and UTG +1s stack sizes.

In my opinion if I was going to speculate on a hand like this in that situation, the UTG +1 and myself would both have to have stacks exceeding 28000 chips. This way you have room to play. This way you aren't speculating with trash with over 10% of your stack.

I do believe that you did a "Donk Call". However, in my opinion that "Donk Call" is the initial call that got you in this mess.

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He knows what he is talking about. Listen to him. lol

late in tournament with QT is always trouble

who knows donk calls are all I see all the time, but they usually get lucky on the river

Shoulda just folded preflop. You only had 10bbs. I dont think its that bad of a call when he shoves but you should just fold or shove preflop if you want to play that hand.

that is bad flop you shold just fold beter luck next time